tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-457782610616273742.post7560112508518938025..comments2018-05-27T04:22:13.975-04:00Comments on Lady of Silences: Congregational Vitality By The NumbersUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-457782610616273742.post-24085645889170642802010-07-09T15:09:54.969-04:002010-07-09T15:09:54.969-04:00Once upon a time we had a priest who was thought n...Once upon a time we had a priest who was thought not to be staying with us for a long time. He was asked how long he would be our priest, and his reply was "As long as St. M's continues to grow." I knew then that he was leaving shortly. And I was right. And we were not completely upset at the departure. I think the metric has to be "Is this an effective Christian Community". Ultimately, it's just a building, and it'll fall down one day. But is the community healthy? Is it spiritually rich, or just a social club or a Sunday habit. That can not be expressed as a number or a percentage...Andy Piercehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03084409889493904605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-457782610616273742.post-79902474315957750002010-07-09T12:25:20.677-04:002010-07-09T12:25:20.677-04:00While I'm not sure if there isn't a bit of...While I'm not sure if there isn't a bit of backhanded classism in there, nevertheless, it speaks to some of what I've seen in our diocese, where most of the parishes are small and struggling, where we have many newly unemployed and other chronically unemployed, where it's a big deal to find the money for gas to drive to church to get to mass or choir practice, and some families have all they can manage to take care of those who are ill, infirm, elderly, disabled, or addicted, to keep discordant marriages together (or survive their break up), to care for children and guide the teens and twenty-somethings, and pull together to meet the needs of those in the community when diaster of various sorts strike, such as fire, or the death of someone in the armed forces, or a recent job loss, etc.<br /><br />It is true that one does not need to be wealthy or gifted with free time or particular intellectual or managerial abilities to get involved in organized kinds of ministries. I recall passages in Sara Mile's Take This Bread about how some of the most needy or troubled people involved in the feeding program would get involved in helping others. Yet, the kinds of church activities, even in terms of mission and outreach, that usally get noticed may require time and skills and energy that are not present in sufficient quantities in some places so as to start or sustain them for very long. Yet there still can be a great deal of love, compassion, and even spiritual growth and maturity in such communities, and it may be that some of the leading indicators of "vitalilty" may be dormant for a season, and will flower later. It just seems to me that church leaders have become so anxious about surviving in a way that preserves some semblance of visible and recognized status, influence, and respectabililty, that there is no time or patience for simply looking people in the eye, taking time to just sit and talk, or kneel and pray, and just... listen for God and see the divine image in each and every one.kladyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09526715552795733402noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-457782610616273742.post-84227275532485443452010-07-09T12:23:58.146-04:002010-07-09T12:23:58.146-04:00I'm so sorry you're getting that kind of p...I'm so sorry you're getting that kind of pressure - even from one crazy emailer. I've always been skeptical of both the numbers game and the high-pitched rhetoric that often goes with it. But I feel like I've learned so much in the past eight months about why all the cardinal indicators of "vitality" really do not mean very much, especially in places experiencing steady declines in population and economic prosperity. <br /><br />The old patterns of church busyness with familiar activities such as attendance at worship, the number of people and hours volunteered in church-run programs and activities, the number and efficacy of established mission and outreach programs within the immediate orbit of the church, the number of ongoing prayer, study, and social groups --all of those and more certainly have been means by which people historically have done church together. Put them all together, especially if bound up in package with a well-maintained building and decent annual giving income, and one has the kind of church one can showcase to bishops, search committees, maybe even newspaper reporters. These are the poster children of "vital" "healthy" congregations.<br /><br />And while it may well be that very fine things are happening in those places, one has to dig deeper and live in relationship with others in other kinds of less visibly "vibrant" contexts to really have any idea of whether they really have the Right Stuff, whether they can, in fact, function remarkably well as Christian communities, provide care and support to each other and to friends, neighbors, and even strangers in the larger community beyond the church. The irony, I think, is that all the Church Growth people and those similarly minded who really believe that they are forging ahead into the Post-Modern era, nevertheless, still measure "success" in terms of tangible results. So while the music and other trappings may change radically, those doing the assessing and the "revitalizing" seem to be still stuck on externals.<br /><br />One of my links in this treatise (or whatever the heck it is) goes to a blog by "churchmouse" that is ultraconservative (from somewhere in the U.K., I believe). He has a series of essays about Church Growth with the focus on Rick Warren's Purpose-Driven Church. While it is kind of mind-boggling to realize that the critique is that Rick Warren is too liberal, in many respects, there are some fundamental, what I would call Catholic, insights.<br /><br />One passage that struck me in particular was this:<br /><br />"Drucker devised the General Systems Theory and the ’feedback mechanism’ (anyone employed today knows what that is). For churches, Buford has developed a Christian Life Profile. Warren has created a Purpose-Driven Life Health Assessment for a believer’s spiritual condition. Criteria in church-based assessments are likely to measure:<br /><br />- Extent of congregation’s growth in numbers or increase in funds – lack of growth is failure.<br /><br />- How many church members volunteered time to church or charity? <br /><br />- How much time did each spend and how often? <br /><br /><b>So, what about those who might not have the intelligence or perceived talent to help transform their local church? I’m talking about the believing high-school dropout who is a responsible and loving parent or an aged, lifelong church member who is house-bound. And what about those who are unable to volunteer at church because they care for an aging parent and work during the day? Will there be a place for them in this man-made construct?"</b><br /><br />[from http://churchmousec.wordpress.com/2010/03/12/rick-warrens-purpose-driven-church-and-management-theory/]kladyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09526715552795733402noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-457782610616273742.post-70313543782979999852010-07-08T17:07:20.691-04:002010-07-08T17:07:20.691-04:00Have just received in a series of email blasts fro...Have just received in a series of email blasts from a vestry member words such as: I really am concerned about your methods of running secular matters and saying I am doing nothing to 'grow the church' (a term I abhor), I am a bit tender but I will say that I am more interested in a healthy church, one with deep spirituality even if the numbers are lower. Our numbers are lower because the toxic people have left or are leaving. Go with God and let us get on with the gospel. And there still has to be a place in the church for those of us who are not jumping on the latest bandwagon.Caminantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16610142955176992982noreply@blogger.com